1. Saint Francis talks about the admixture of the love of the Savior and the love of other things. Is he stating that it is wrong to love other things? What is his point here?2. Connected with that, how should our love of Mary and the Saints be considered in light of this reflection? Is there a danger of loving the saints above Jesus?3. Does the height of love that Saint Francis describe at times feel unattainable? Are these unrealistic goals for us?4. St. Francis talks about the growth of the “novice-soul,
Jun 27, 10:11 AM
Sister Susan
Marie (Moderator): or those in spiritual infancy, from loving God
imperfectly, toward living a life of perfection. How can we progress in this
path? How can we avoid complacency here?
5. To avoid becoming like the rich young man, how do we avoid having too much
attachment to things before needing to practice detachment? Otherwise, how do
we practice detachment from things?
Jun 27, 10:11 AM
Jun 30, 7:48 PM
Dawn (Guest): this week I think I have more questions and realizations coming than answers
Jun 30, 7:52 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): It is all grace
Jun 30, 7:53 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): That actually sounds interesting Dawn!
Jun 30, 7:53 PM
Ruth (Guest): Yes, Dawn.
Jun 30, 7:54 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): And it means spiritual growth is happening
Jun 30, 7:54 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): I think so anyway!
Jun 30, 7:54 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): Welcome viewers
Jun 30, 7:55 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): Do you have an example of a realization, Dawn
Jun 30, 7:55 PM
Ruth (Guest): #1 I don’t think St Francis is stating that it is WRONG to love other things than the Savior; but we must be careful that they not be superfluous, vain or even dangerous things. That is part of the “Infancy” of the love of Jesus.
Jun 30, 7:55 PM
Ruth (Guest): Tell, us, yes, please, Dawn about what you’ve been realizing lately.
Jun 30, 7:56 PM
Dawn (Guest): Well, this reflection spoke straight to my heart. Being overly attached to even those good things God wills for us
Jun 30, 7:57 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): It is positive when one can see for oneself an over attachment rather than someone else pointing that out to one, because that in itself shows maturity
Jun 30, 7:58 PM
Dawn (Guest): or loving what is so deserving of love and yet becoming overtaken , thinking this is what God has called for me….to love (what he loves) very much
Jun 30, 7:59 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): You mean like assuming something because of the strength of the attraction, for ex One likes retreats so one assumes one should be a religious
Jun 30, 8:00 PM
Dawn (Guest): realizing that it all comes from his grace and apart from him, we can do nothing. so the temptation ( and to follow suffering) here is to lose sight of this….
Jun 30, 8:00 PM
Ruth (Guest): Not sure, Dawn, what you mean. Certainly not loving your grans inordinately or your sons, or their wives? Maybe not perfectly — freedom giving love — but not excessively?
Jun 30, 8:01 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): Hello guest 2369
Jun 30, 8:01 PM
Guest2369 (Guest): Hi
Jun 30, 8:02 PM
Ruth (Guest): Glad you notice, Sister. I don’t see who is signed on when I have the rest of the page open.
Jun 30, 8:02 PM
Ruth (Guest): Hi Guest 2369.
Jun 30, 8:03 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): Sometimes when we journal spiritually and read back a year or two later we see more clearly because experience adds to our understanding
Jun 30, 8:03 PM
Dawn (Guest): that is a good example, Ruth and 6314
Jun 30, 8:03 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): So we’re that grace!
Jun 30, 8:04 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): Or see that grace
Jun 30, 8:04 PM
Dawn (Guest): journaling is a great idea!
Jun 30, 8:04 PM
Dawn (Guest): important I think
Jun 30, 8:05 PM
Guest2369 (Guest): What’s the discussion?
Jun 30, 8:05 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): We grow in spirals sometimes
Jun 30, 8:05 PM
Dawn (Guest): ahh, and this is where writing would benefit
Jun 30, 8:06 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): Can someone repost one of the questions I can,t manage it with the instrument I am using!
Jun 30, 8:06 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): Hi Carol Anne
Jun 30, 8:07 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): Srr SUsan here
Jun 30, 8:07 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): In DC
Jun 30, 8:07 PM
Ruth (Guest): That’s a good point, Sister. I used to journal a lot. Now I do far too little. I’d like to do it more. Today, I found an old journal which I’d titled, because the pages were all black, and it was partly used when I got it, with a silver moon and star on the cover: Ruth’s Book of Things that Can Brighten Dark Days.
Jun 30, 8:07 PM
Carol Ann: Hi Everyone! Formation was good today!
Jun 30, 8:07 PM
Ruth (Guest): Hello Carol Ann.
Jun 30, 8:08 PM
Dawn (Guest): Hi Carol Ann
Jun 30, 8:08 PM
Guest2369 (Guest): Hello Carol Ann
Jun 30, 8:09 PM
Dawn (Guest): Question 1 Saint Francis talks about the admixture of the love of the Savior and the love of other things. Is he stating that it is wrong to love other things? What is his point here?
Jun 30, 8:10 PM
Dawn (Guest): 2. Connected with that, how should our love of Mary and the Saints be considered in light of this reflection? Is there a danger of loving the saints above Jesus?
Jun 30, 8:10 PM
Ruth (Guest): Saint Francis talks
about the admixture of the love of the Savior and the love of other things. Is
he stating that it is wrong to love other things? What is his point here?
Connected with that, how should our love of Mary and the Saints be considered
in light of this reflection? Is there a danger of loving the saints above
Jesus?
Does the height of love that Saint Francis describe at times feel unattainable?
Are these unrealistic goals fo
Jun 30, 8:10 PM
Carol Ann: We were actually just discussing how I find myself attached to past events and going over and over them
Jun 30, 8:11 PM
Dawn (Guest): you are not alone Carol Ann, I do and wish I could not
Jun 30, 8:11 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): That amazing and divine providence at work
Jun 30, 8:11 PM
Ruth (Guest): #3 Does the height of love that Saint Francis describe at times feel unattainable? Are these unrealistic goals for us?
Jun 30, 8:12 PM
Guest2369 (Guest): Interesting.
Jun 30, 8:13 PM
Ruth (Guest): I think I do that, too, Carol Ann.
Jun 30, 8:13 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): All of us grow to holiness at a different pace and under different circumstances so events people etc occur in our lives in those areas that help us grow at least that is my experience
Jun 30, 8:13 PM
Carol Ann: Dawn, sometimes I just want to rejoice in something I’ve learned about the event and sometimes I’m just stuck
Jun 30, 8:14 PM
Ruth (Guest): Even the mention of the little book. It was from February 2004, and the first page: Remembering you love, oh Lord. Trusting in your promises.
Jun 30, 8:15 PM
Ruth (Guest): It is good, Carol Ann, that you can distinguish the two.
Jun 30, 8:15 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): Wee can be surprised by the depth of our spiritual lives that were already activated years ago but we keep growing hopefully Nothing is impossible with the Lord!
Jun 30, 8:16 PM
Dawn (Guest): Sr, would you say this is by his will, allowing those things or people in our life which will help our soul grow?
Jun 30, 8:16 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): Hi I Carroll
Jun 30, 8:16 PM
Ruth (Guest): Hi Carroll!
Jun 30, 8:16 PM
Carol Ann: That’s a new grace, Ruth
Jun 30, 8:17 PM
Carroll (Guest): Hi everyone- sorry our supper ran late here… just catching up
Jun 30, 8:17 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): Yes Dawn definitely
Jun 30, 8:17 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): I once had a problem with people I thought I had outgrown or overcome. I certainly did with one person Then another came along and. Same problem
Jun 30, 8:17 PM
Ruth (Guest): I don’t understand, Carol Ann. I think it is a grace that has to be renewed over and over again.
Jun 30, 8:18 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): Ex priest told me something like, in direction, you got thru thi and now you have a new test!
Jun 30, 8:18 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): Not ex priest, the priest
Jun 30, 8:18 PM
Ruth (Guest): The second page said: Remembering my CHOIICE to bless your holy name, oh Lord, ALWAYS.
Jun 30, 8:19 PM
Carol Ann: It does, Ruth. But it is a new grace that I can often see good in a negative experience now
Jun 30, 8:19 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): See how committed to the Lord you have been Ruth!
Jun 30, 8:19 PM
Guest2369 (Guest): Dear Sr, how could one remain holy when facing test?
Jun 30, 8:20 PM
Ruth (Guest): Ex here probably meant “Example.”
Jun 30, 8:20 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): God is holy and we, as members of His Body, share in that holiness especially if we draw on g
Jun 30, 8:20 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): God,s grace to help us when we are challenged
Jun 30, 8:22 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): MY personality is a rather accepting one, rather than a challenging one, so when I am in a position that needs to challenge something I really struggle
Jun 30, 8:22 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): SO the Lord provides plenty of those so I can grow
Jun 30, 8:22 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): I grow very slowly!
Jun 30, 8:23 PM
Guest2369 (Guest): I think as a religious, you are face your test with holiness. How can we be holy and grow?
Jun 30, 8:23 PM
Carroll (Guest): For me it has been an important lesson that both reason and faith are important in times of trial or when undergoing test…
Jun 30, 8:23 PM
Ruth (Guest): If only, Sister! We have a new Pastor, and he used the expression: The road to hell is paved with good intentions. I FEEL like I’ve been stumbling along on that road for a good long time. I need to be picked up by the scruff of my neck and dropped down where I can DO the good I intend.
Jun 30, 8:24 PM
Dawn (Guest): yes! lately, I have thought I was repeating. or I thought that was over and now he is showing me, no it is not…have to go deeper. I thought this was healed and then… wow.
Jun 30, 8:24 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): BY prayer, first of all
Jun 30, 8:24 PM
Guest2369 (Guest): Do you mean prayer leads us to being holy?
Jun 30, 8:24 PM
Ruth (Guest): Slowly but surely, Sister.
Jun 30, 8:25 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): Yes prayer ca n lead to holiness
Jun 30, 8:25 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): Then the good actions that flow from praer
Jun 30, 8:25 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): Prayer
Jun 30, 8:26 PM
Guest2369 (Guest): What are good actions?
Jun 30, 8:26 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): Loving deeds, simple ones perhaps, helping another, thinking of another,s need before one,s own
Jun 30, 8:27 PM
Guest2369 (Guest): Wow. I hope I can be holy.
Jun 30, 8:27 PM
Ruth (Guest): Dawn, healing comes little by little. I’m not at all sure that in this life there is a “once and for all” especially of trauma.
Jun 30, 8:27 PM
Carol Ann: Feeding the hungry, clothing the naked, visiting the sick
Jun 30, 8:27 PM
Dawn (Guest): thanks Ruth
Jun 30, 8:28 PM
Guest2369 (Guest): Sr, what type of prayer is that? I would to learn.
Jun 30, 8:29 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): The best is talking to God in your own words, from what you feel in your heart
Jun 30, 8:29 PM
Guest2369 (Guest): Is there any requirements?
Jun 30, 8:29 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): There are many formal prayers Jesus taught us the Our Father That is even better probably
Jun 30, 8:29 PM
Ruth (Guest): But healing proceeds. And discovering that it was not complete when you thought it was is part of that healing. It is TRUTH — being face to face with the truth, acknowledging it. Accepting it. Learning. . .
Jun 30, 8:30 PM
Carroll (Guest): When I am reminded of my trauma… or when patterns seem to start repeating…or when I realize I am still broken, I thank our dearest Lord for drawing me ever so closely to Himself. For, what was His Passion? Trauma.
Jun 30, 8:30 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): Beautiful
Jun 30, 8:30 PM
Carol Ann: Carroll, t that is so beautiful
Jun 30, 8:31 PM
Guest6314 (Guest): I need to leave now but am so glad to have been able to be here tonight Many blessings to each of you dear friends
Jun 30, 8:31 PM
Dawn (Guest): Happy you were here, thank you1
Jun 30, 8:32 PM
Carol Ann: Have a blessed week
Jun 30, 8:32 PM
Guest2369 (Guest): Will you be here next week
Jun 30, 8:32 PM
Carroll (Guest): When we surrender and offer ourselves, even trauma can become a grace…Nothing is impossible for God!
Jun 30, 8:33 PM
Guest2369 (Guest): I like to learn something from you
Jun 30, 8:34 PM
Ruth (Guest): Thank you, Sister Susan, “Guest” 6314. It is a very good thing you do by introducing us to St. Francis’s writings and to one another. May God bless your discussions over the next couple of days. Peace.
Jun 30, 8:34 PM
Dawn (Guest): Amen.
Jun 30, 8:35 PM
Carol Ann: Amen
Jun 30, 8:36 PM
Carroll (Guest): Once again, thank you all for being here! I am so grateful for all of you and for this time of prayerful reflection with you. Duties call, so I will look forward to next week. Blessings!
Jun 30, 8:36 PM
Dawn (Guest): I think this weeks reflection choice is so helpful, I will read and pray think on it this week.
Jun 30, 8:36 PM
Ruth (Guest): I agree Carroll. He has allowed it so that we can be more perfectly united to Him. It often does not seem so; but when I’ve asked Him: Where were you when . . . ? He simply replied, I was THERE.
Jun 30, 8:36 PM
Dawn (Guest): Hi Carroll…..and hope to see you next week!
Jun 30, 8:36 PM
Carroll (Guest): Amen!
Jun 30, 8:38 PM
Ruth (Guest): Carroll, the woman you care for is one fortunate person to have you as care-giver.
Jun 30, 8:39 PM
Dawn (Guest): yes, she is
Jun 30, 8:41 PM
Ruth (Guest): Dawn, I am sorry I have not been more available to you — or for that matter to anyone, especially during these trying times. But you ARE prayed for; and you are being taught by the Spirit of God.
Jun 30, 8:41 PM
Dawn (Guest): God bless you, Ruth
Jun 30, 8:41 PM
Carol Ann: I too am praying for the whole group. My times up is so regimented though
Jun 30, 8:42 PM
Dawn (Guest): Carol Ann, hope to see you next week.
Jun 30, 8:42 PM
Ruth (Guest): I am certain that God has allowed me to live this long because he is very patient, and I am such a slow learner, but he knows that really do want to learn to love well.
Jun 30, 8:43 PM
Carol Ann: I should be here but tardy. My formation assistant has us meeting from 4-5 California time
Jun 30, 8:44 PM
Dawn (Guest): How we loved ….this perhaps is what he will look at….
Jun 30, 8:44 PM
Ruth (Guest): Thank you. All of you, for being here. Brian would probably also be interested to know that on the Feast of Corpus Christi we had, after Mass, a presentation about Kairos. It is coming to the local prison, especially the YOUTH group.
Jun 30, 8:44 PM
Carol Ann: I have heard it is the first, most important thing He looks at
Jun 30, 8:45 PM
Dawn (Guest): so that is right into chat time….
Jun 30, 8:45 PM
Dawn (Guest): this is wonderful Ruth! I am certain Brian will love to hear about it
Jun 30, 8:45 PM
Carol Ann: Yes, and my brothers wedding is coming up, so there is another week I cannot be here at all
Jun 30, 8:46 PM
Dawn (Guest): not here for a beautiful reason Carol Ann!
Jun 30, 8:47 PM
Dawn (Guest): Ruth, do you think if you are so called, you could be involved in Karios there?
Jun 30, 8:47 PM
Carol Ann: Seriously! I am getting “insta-family, just add water
Jun 30, 8:47 PM
Dawn (Guest):
Jun 30, 8:49 PM
Dawn (Guest): we may not speak often outside of chat, but I hold you all in my prayers. and they can come suddenly!
Jun 30, 8:50 PM
Dawn (Guest): God’s love to you all….goodnight!
Jun 30, 8:50 PM
Carol Ann: The Spirit whispers pray now!
Jun 30, 8:52 PM
Carol Ann: Good night and God bless you!
Jun 30, 8:52 PM
Ruth (Guest): Yes, Carol Ann, although Paul says, All things are possible for those who love Christ 4 PM there IS 7 PM here and 5 PM is 8 PM here, halfway through the chat. Perhaps, if you let your formation assistant know about the “overlap” . . . ? Maybe? We love you if you come early or if you come late. We love you even when we do not hear from you for some time. I’m still praying for Judy, too. And . . . will Jennifer ever find her “place?” God is good. And he is with us on this journey — even when we feel
Jun 30, 8:52 PM
Ruth (Guest): lost.
Jun 30, 8:54 PM
Carol Ann: I should be way better about emailing all of you so we can stay up with each other
Jun 30, 8:54 PM
Ruth (Guest): No, Dawn, I do not think I will be directly involved in Kairos here, because it is, at least for now, only men and young men. And reps willing and able to travel long distances to attend state meetings.
Jun 30, 8:56 PM
Carol Ann: I wonder what is the women’s equivalent of Kairos
Jun 30, 8:57 PM
Ruth (Guest): Perhaps when my health issues are no longer so demanding I’ll become more involved in the Women’s Cursillo. Kairos grew out of the Cursillo movement.
Jun 30, 8:58 PM
Ruth (Guest): There are women’s Kairos groups, too. Brian told us about them. But that is not likely to start around HERE very soon.
Jun 30, 8:59 PM
Carol Ann: A little too non-traditional?
Jun 30, 9:00 PM
Ruth (Guest): I’m not sure what you mean, Carol Ann. Kairos is interdenominational. “Ecumenical” the speaker said.
Jun 30, 9:01 PM
Carol Ann: Oh, I was thinking tgevopposite
Jun 30, 9:01 PM
Ruth (Guest): I think they were thinking mostly about the relative NEEDS of those in the prisons. There are a lot more men than women.
Jun 30, 9:01 PM
Carol Ann: The opposite
Jun 30, 9:02 PM
Ruth (Guest): Opposite?
Jun 30, 9:04 PM
Carol Ann: The opposite of ecumenical. A closed group, more conservative thinking than liberal. Shows you how little I really know about Kairos
Jun 30, 9:07 PM
Ruth (Guest): Oh. Practically all I knew until now was what Brian would say. Here’s a link, if you want to learn more: http://www.kairosprisonministry.org/
Jun 30, 9:07 PM
Carol Ann: Thank you!
Jun 30, 9:10 PM
Ruth (Guest): I like the word Kairos; it means the opportune time. Timeless time. Like when something important — an important decision, experience e.g. is taking place. It is different from “chronos.” That is what you seem to be suffering from, at least a little, Carol Ann. That’s measurable, (regimented?) time.
Jun 30, 9:10 PM
Carol Ann: I’d better let you get off to bed. It’s getting late where you are
Jun 30, 9:11 PM
Ruth (Guest): Thanks for your consideration Carol Ann. I still have to send a photo of a painting to a friend in Switzerland. I tried last night and did not succeed.
Jun 30, 9:12 PM
Ruth (Guest): God bless you, Carol Ann. . .
Jun 30, 9:12 PM
Carol Ann: I will ask the Holy Angels to help. They always help me with computer stuff
Jun 30, 9:13 PM
Carol Ann: I will find your email addresses and see if I can’t get back to communicating better
Jun 30, 9:14 PM
Carol Ann: Sleep well!
Jun 30, 9:15 PM
Ruth (Guest): Funny, it occurs to me just now. I saw a man today in a black t-shirt that said “May the FOREST be with you!” and I was thinking, in the Forest we experience Kairos. And I translated that to, for you, “May the Horse be with you!” — if that is possible, if you still ride horses, and the experience gives you sense of timelessness. Peace. Sleep well