What do you make of Saint Francis
saying that in this life charity will never be perfected to the point that we
will be without fear? Should this make us despair? Does this hinder motivation
for growing in charity?
Why is servile fear necessary, according to Saint Francis?
How do we find the balance between a fear of God’s judgments and hope in God’s
promises and mercy?
Is there a conflict between God’s justice and God’s mercy?
Nov 28, 11:10 AM
Sister Susan Marie (Moderator): Sun chat Dec 1 730pm est
Dec 1, 7:24 PM
VisitationSiste: welcome viewer!
Dec 1, 7:25 PM
Jennifer Koo: I think they will come later
Dec 1, 7:26 PM
VisitationSiste: It’s still early, yes
Dec 1, 7:27 PM
Blanca Villa: Hello everyone!
Dec 1, 7:27 PM
VisitationSiste: Blessed Advent, Blanca!
Dec 1, 7:27 PM
Jennifer Koo: Hi Blanca
Dec 1, 7:29 PM
VisitationSiste: Is all well with you?
Dec 1, 7:30 PM
Blanca Villa: Yes, thank you. I had an adventurous start to adven
Dec 1, 7:30 PM
Dawn (Guest): Happy Advent!
Dec 1, 7:30 PM
VisitationSiste: Hi Dawn! Blessed Advent to you too!
Dec 1, 7:30 PM
Jennifer Koo: Hello, Dawn
Dec 1, 7:31 PM
Dawn (Guest): Hi Sr Susan Blanca and Jennifer
Dec 1, 7:31 PM
Blanca Villa: I went to Mass and my car almost left me in the parking lot. I prayed like never before while driving home that my truck wouldn’t stop.
Dec 1, 7:32 PM
VisitationSiste: Do you mean it would not work?
Dec 1, 7:33 PM
VisitationSiste: I am ready with the first q: What do you make of Saint Francis saying that in this life charity will never be perfected to the point that we will be without fear?
Dec 1, 7:33 PM
Blanca Villa: It would start , but it kept shaking and didn’t quite want to move forward. I was scared that it would stop along the way, but I made it home safely and in the morning it goes to the mechanic
Dec 1, 7:34 PM
Blanca Villa: Praise God for getting me home🙏
Dec 1, 7:34 PM
Brian (Guest): Hi Sister Susan , Dawn , Blanca Villa ,and Jennifer ! God Bless You !!!
Dec 1, 7:34 PM
Dawn (Guest): Is it snowing where you are Blanca?
Dec 1, 7:34 PM
Jennifer Koo: Hi Brain
Dec 1, 7:34 PM
VisitationSiste: Hi Brian!
Dec 1, 7:34 PM
Dawn (Guest): Hi Brian~
Dec 1, 7:34 PM
Dawn (Guest): !
Dec 1, 7:35 PM
Blanca Villa: No, I live in the San Joaquin Valley in CA. It’s raining and cold only.
Dec 1, 7:35 PM
Jennifer Koo: Hi Guest 9846
Dec 1, 7:36 PM
VisitationSiste: St Francis de sales wrote: In this life, therefore, wherein our charity will never come to such perfection that it shall be exempt from peril, fear is always necessary, and even while we thrill with joy by love, we must tremble with apprehension by fear. Serve ye the Lord with fear, and rejoice unto him with trembling.
Dec 1, 7:37 PM
Guest9846 (Guest): Hello
Dec 1, 7:37 PM
Guest9846 (Guest): Blessings!
Dec 1, 7:37 PM
Jennifer Koo: Yes, it is difficult to be fearless
Dec 1, 7:38 PM
VisitationSiste: welcome 9846!
Dec 1, 7:38 PM
Brian (Guest): Hi Guest 9846 ! God Bless You !
Dec 1, 7:38 PM
VisitationSiste: That fear is necessary seems to be a bit of a surprise
Dec 1, 7:39 PM
VisitationSiste: I understand fear as awe, but fright type- fear?
Dec 1, 7:40 PM
Brian (Guest): Perfect Love Casts out Fear because fear causes torment !
Dec 1, 7:41 PM
Blanca Villa: Could fear be interpreted as respect? I have never feared God, but I do fear that I could lose God in my life.
Dec 1, 7:41 PM
VisitationSiste: I think so
Dec 1, 7:41 PM
Brian (Guest): Remembering the overwhelming Love and provision of God in all things can shift us away from our fears too trust in God !!!
Dec 1, 7:41 PM
Jennifer Koo: According to St Francis de Sales, fear will always be there because we are not perfect
Dec 1, 7:42 PM
VisitationSiste: But as for perfect love what does St Francis mean by this St Francis de sales wrote: In this life, therefore, wherein our charity will never come to such perfection that it shall be exempt from peril, fear is always necessary, and ev
Dec 1, 7:43 PM
Ruth (Guest): Greetings. Good turn out tonight.
Dec 1, 7:43 PM
Jennifer Koo: I suppose if our charity is perfect, we will have no fear in whatsoever situation
Dec 1, 7:43 PM
VisitationSiste: Hi Ruth! Blessed advent!
Dec 1, 7:43 PM
VisitationSiste: Can it be perfect? St Francis seems not to be saying that? I wonder
Dec 1, 7:43 PM
Jennifer Koo: Hi Ruth, I have been praying for you day and night. Hope you are much better
Dec 1, 7:44 PM
Jennifer Koo: Maybe one day it can be perfect
Dec 1, 7:44 PM
Jennifer Koo: The problem is can it remain perfect all the time
Dec 1, 7:44 PM
Brian (Guest): I believe the bigger the battle the more the enemy throws darts of fear at us , but it is in these times that our Faith and Trust in God can really Grow and we allow God to continue too help more and more Souls to know Him !!!!
Dec 1, 7:45 PM
Brian (Guest): Hi Ruth ! God Bless You !!!
Dec 1, 7:46 PM
Dawn (Guest): Hi Ruth
Dec 1, 7:47 PM
VisitationSiste: Why is servile fear necessary, according to Saint Francis?
Dec 1, 7:48 PM
Jennifer Koo: Firstly, maybe we need to understand about charity
Dec 1, 7:49 PM
Ruth (Guest): Thank you for your prayers.
Dec 1, 7:49 PM
Brian (Guest): Keeps us Humble and looking toward God !!!
Dec 1, 7:50 PM
VisitationSiste: They are intertwined- look at this passage: God often sends servile fear to arrange the marriage between the soul and sacred love. But though the soul comes under the conduct of fear, she does not mean to espouse it; for, in fact, as soon as the soul meets with love, she unites herself unto it, and quits fear.
Dec 1, 7:50 PM
Jennifer Koo: In Christian theology, Charity (Latin Caritas) is considered as one of the seven virtues and is understood by Thomas Aquinas as “the friendship of man for God”, which “unites us to God”. He holds it as “the most excellent of the virtues”. Further, Aquinas holds that “the habit of charity extends not only to the love of God, but also to the love of our neighbor”.
Dec 1, 7:50 PM
Jennifer Koo: The Catechism of the Catholic Church defines “charity” as “the theological virtue by which we love God above all things for His own sake, and our neighbor as ourselves for the love of God”
Dec 1, 7:52 PM
Ruth (Guest): You’ve been doing your homework, Jennifer!
Dec 1, 7:52 PM
Jennifer Koo: O, yes
Dec 1, 7:53 PM
Jennifer Koo: I am thankful that now my job is “Nun”, yesterday I went to the dentist and I was told to fill that as my job
Dec 1, 7:53 PM
Brian (Guest): Could the presence of fear perhaps be a crack of self-centeredness returning allowing us too flee immediately to God !!!
Dec 1, 7:54 PM
VisitationSiste: like that- flee to God!
Dec 1, 7:55 PM
Ruth (Guest): fill the tooth, or go to the dentist as part of your “job’?
Dec 1, 7:55 PM
VisitationSiste: SFDS: fear, having led us to holy love, remains still with us, to serve both love and the loving soul as occasion requires.
Dec 1, 7:56 PM
Jennifer Koo: I was filling in the form
Dec 1, 7:56 PM
Ruth (Guest): Got it.
Dec 1, 7:56 PM
Brian (Guest): Amen Sister Susan !!!
Dec 1, 7:57 PM
Ruth (Guest): Fear as useful as the occasion requires.
Dec 1, 7:57 PM
Jennifer Koo: Thank you Mother
Dec 1, 7:57 PM
VisitationSiste: How do we find the balance between a fear o of God’s judgments and hope in God’s promises and mercy?
Dec 1, 7:59 PM
Jennifer Koo: To fear of judgments is more of a slave but being children of God we hope in His promises and mercy
Dec 1, 8:00 PM
VisitationSiste: we must be merciful to others too
Dec 1, 8:01 PM
Ruth (Guest): I think when we are on the right path hope prevails. When we go astray, if our consciences are rightly formed, fear of God’s judgement will help bring us back to Him.
Dec 1, 8:02 PM
Jennifer Koo: Sure we have to be merciful to others and a lot of times we live our life by the mercy of others too
Dec 1, 8:02 PM
Brian (Guest): It’s helps us to see the progress we have made . Before I knew God I really had no idea that what I was doing was wrong . As I am getting to know God He is teaching me what is right and what is wrong and I have opportunity to make better choices out of sincere Love of God !!!
Dec 1, 8:03 PM
Ruth (Guest): Trouble is, today, many seem to confuse a clear conscience with just feeling good, making one’s judgement based upon societal norms instead of upon God’s law.
Dec 1, 8:03 PM
VisitationSiste: a person’s conscience must be well formed
Dec 1, 8:05 PM
Brian (Guest): People just don’t know God at all . We must introduce them too Him anyway we can !!!
Dec 1, 8:05 PM
Jennifer Koo: The media have great influence too
Dec 1, 8:05 PM
Ruth (Guest): That’s a good example Brian. My, what a long way God has brought you! Now you have become a powerful evangelizer.
Dec 1, 8:05 PM
Ruth (Guest): So true Jennifer.
Dec 1, 8:06 PM
VisitationSiste: we were just talking about evangelization today at dinner Brian
Dec 1, 8:08 PM
Jennifer Koo: I love to evangelize
Dec 1, 8:08 PM
Brian (Guest): Soo many people introduced me too God in soo many different ways Ruth !!! I am soo Greatful too God and all His Children That have helped me . I Hope and Pray that I can Help others too know God !!!
Dec 1, 8:08 PM
Ruth (Guest): I was looking at some very old children’s school readers. Each of the stories had a moral, some positive values. Now TVs are used as baby sitters! One must be so careful: what goes in is likely to closely resemble what come out of a child.
Dec 1, 8:09 PM
Jennifer Koo: The moral value of the modern world has changed and media has a part in it
Dec 1, 8:10 PM
Ruth (Guest): Brian. Reminds me of a Christmas card I read today: May JOY fill your holiday. Share joy.
Dec 1, 8:11 PM
VisitationSiste: Beautiful and the perfect season for joy!
Dec 1, 8:12 PM
VisitationSiste: what is the advent perspective do you think on God’s justice and God’s mercy?
Dec 1, 8:12 PM
Brian (Guest): Amen Ruth !!! Kairos Retreat starts Thursday -Sunday !!!! Over 30 new Men signed up !!! Keep them all in your Prayers !!!!
Dec 1, 8:13 PM
Brian (Guest): The Joy of the Lord is Our Strength !!!
Dec 1, 8:14 PM
Ruth (Guest): I think every season is the perfect season for joy, because Christ who died for us LIVES. But what “shows” when we are hurting may not be the joy even if it is there, deep down inside us.
Dec 1, 8:15 PM
Ruth (Guest): Beauty, truth, joy. They are contagious!
Dec 1, 8:17 PM
Brian (Guest): I think back at the terrible things done in my life without God and I am Greatful for the new Life that He has brought me !!! God has been soo kind and Merciful too me !!!! I Hope that I can be as Kind and Merciful too others as God has been too me !!!!
Dec 1, 8:17 PM
Ruth (Guest): Genuine joy can coexist with struggle, pain, even a feeling of being God-forsaken. Bishop Barron points to the cross and says: That is a picture of perfect happiness! Perfect freedom!
Dec 1, 8:19 PM
Brian (Guest): We must give our lives for others as Jesus gave up His Life for us !!!!
Dec 1, 8:19 PM
VisitationSiste: and it is happening arounfd the world REd Sunday!!
Dec 1, 8:19 PM
Ruth (Guest): You and your Mission to those men are in my prayers, Brian. God, and your Christian friends in Kairos have prepared you well.
Dec 1, 8:20 PM
Ruth (Guest): REd Sunday?
Dec 1, 8:20 PM
Jennifer Koo: The definition fear is a feeling induced by perceived danger or threat. As a result, only perfect love and cast out fear
Dec 1, 8:20 PM
VisitationSiste: for persecuted Christians. is that not so Sr Jennifer?
Dec 1, 8:21 PM
Jennifer Koo: Yes, our retreat master mentioned it during our retreat
Dec 1, 8:22 PM
Ruth (Guest): Tell me more. There have been more Christian martyrs in the first part of this century than in all the Roman persecutions in the early Church.
Dec 1, 8:23 PM
Jennifer Koo: He said that in the world now, at least 145 countries are persecuting Christains
Dec 1, 8:24 PM
Jennifer Koo: I think the Bishop called for the Red Sunday for this
Dec 1, 8:24 PM
Brian (Guest): Thank You Ruth for all your prayers for Men . Great opportunity for them too share the horrors that they have lived through and too allow God to begin healing process !!!!
Dec 1, 8:24 PM
VisitationSiste: Maybe just in our Diocese?
Dec 1, 8:24 PM
Ruth (Guest): Ours is, too, but less openly and less “bloody.”
Dec 1, 8:24 PM
Jennifer Koo: I supposed only for Brooklyn
Dec 1, 8:25 PM
Ruth (Guest): Do they wear the martyrs’ red vestment even though it is Advent.
Dec 1, 8:27 PM
Dawn (Guest): persecution comes in many forms. And Jesus says just pray for those who persecute you
Dec 1, 8:27 PM
Ruth (Guest): I’ve been advocating here for AT LEAST a brief public prayer at each Mass for martyrs around the world for some time now. Guess I haven’t done a very good job of it. I never heard of RED Sunday.
Dec 1, 8:28 PM
Dawn (Guest): God bless you all! Blessed Advent..Jesus is coming! Goodnight all
Dec 1, 8:28 PM
Jennifer Koo: O, It’s time to say Good night. Blessings to all
Dec 1, 8:29 PM
Sister Susan Marie (Moderator): Have a blessed advent week!
Dec 1, 8:29 PM
Brian (Guest): God Bless You Dawn !!!! Keep Shining For Jesus !!!!
Dec 1, 8:29 PM
Ruth (Guest): Dawn, I don’t think Jesus says JUST pray for those who persecute you. Sometimes that is all we can do. He says PRAY for those who persecute you. There is a difference. We need to DO what is necessary AND POSSIBLE to us to end persecution in all of its forms.
Dec 1, 8:30 PM
Guest9846 (Guest): Good night to everyone. Thank you for this opportunity to visit. Blessings!
Dec 1, 8:31 PM
Brian (Guest): God Bless You All !!! Many Prayers for all your Loving Service for Our Lord Jesus Christ !!!
Dec 1, 8:33 PM
Ruth (Guest): That is a confusion I’ve been a participant in on many occasions — “Seeing” in my mind, Christ condemned by Pilot, SILENT, and thinking that is the model I should follow. He KNEW His Father’s will to include the Cross by then.
Dec 1, 8:34 PM
Ruth (Guest): Good night Guest 9846. May you have a blessed Advent. Come again.