| Of his injured leg, St. Francis wrote: “at this rate I should never want it to get better; no, not even if your Mother had come and had brought you along with her.” Was this a little tongue-in-cheek joke, or do you think it was a translation issue? What do you believe is at the heart of this letter? What is the purpose of the emphasis that we are brothers and sisters in Christ? Is this just a nicety or does it have a deeper meaning? What is more important, or souls or our bodies? What is more important, or souls or our bodies? St. Francis mentions being with everyone in the “eternal liberty of love.” If we so often view love as self-sacrifice here on earth, what does love look like in the Trinity and what does love look like in Heaven where there is no need for giving of oneself in the midst of suffering and sin? |
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We adore daily in Brooklyn Monastery
Sep 4, 7:23 PM
VisitationSR (Guest): Hi Carol!
Sep 4, 7:25 PM
VisitationSR (Guest): and Simone-hi
Sep 4, 7:26 PM
Simone (Guest): Hi, I missed you all.. it seems as it has been so long
Sep 4, 7:26 PM
VisitationSR (Guest): to me too several weeks, no
Sep 4, 7:26 PM
Simone (Guest): But we host a lot of guests on Sunday nights
Sep 4, 7:26 PM
Simone (Guest): specially in the summer
Sep 4, 7:27 PM
VisitationSR (Guest): That is important!
Sep 4, 7:27 PM
VisitationSR (Guest): I am going to change my location to another computer be back soon
Sep 4, 7:27 PM
Simone (Guest): I did not get your email this week Sister
Sep 4, 7:27 PM
VisitationSR (Guest): I will tell webmaster
Sep 4, 7:27 PM
Carol (Guest): Hi Simone, Hi Sr Susan
Sep 4, 7:28 PM
Simone (Guest): Hi Carol..
Sep 4, 7:28 PM
Simone (Guest): I also did not get the reminder before the chat today
Sep 4, 7:28 PM
Simone (Guest): just to pass it on to the webmaster
Sep 4, 7:28 PM
Simone (Guest): Carol… did you get all the emails?
Sep 4, 7:28 PM
Carol (Guest): I didn’t get either one either
Sep 4, 7:28 PM
Simone (Guest): Ok.so there must be a glitch
Sep 4, 7:29 PM
Simone (Guest): quickly have to help my husband for a minute
Sep 4, 7:29 PM
Carol (Guest): We just count on me remembering🙂
Welcome to our Living Jesus Chat Room. Just sign in, using any of the methods below.
Sep 4, 7:29 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): Yes something went wrong I will report it
Sep 4, 7:30 PM
Dawn (Guest): Hello Sr Susan!
Sep 4, 7:30 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): Hi Dawn
Sep 4, 7:30 PM
Carol (Guest): Hi Dawn!
Sep 4, 7:30 PM
Dawn (Guest): And Simone, Carol too!
Sep 4, 7:30 PM
Dawn (Guest): I received the email ok
Sep 4, 7:30 PM
Carol (Guest): Did I tell you the news yet?
Sep 4, 7:30 PM
John (Guest): Hi Sr. Susan
Sep 4, 7:30 PM
Simone (Guest): What NEWS Carol?????
Sep 4, 7:31 PM
Carol (Guest): Hi John
Sep 4, 7:31 PM
Simone (Guest): Hi Dawn.. lovely to see you again
Sep 4, 7:31 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): welcome John
Sep 4, 7:31 PM
Simone (Guest): Hi John.. Not sure if we have met yet.
Sep 4, 7:31 PM
Dawn (Guest): Thank you, you as well!
Sep 4, 7:31 PM
John (Guest): Hi Simone — no, I get the emails
Sep 4, 7:31 PM
Carol (Guest): Ooh, I did not then. On October 1 at the 4pm Mass, I will be taking final vows
Sep 4, 7:31 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): No Carol we are waiting for the news !
Sep 4, 7:31 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): wonderful God be praised!
Sep 4, 7:31 PM
Simone (Guest): oh Carol .. that is AMAZING.
Sep 4, 7:32 PM
Simone (Guest): I pray for the preparation for your
2 PM
Simone (Guest): I pray for the preparation for your heart
Sep 4, 7:32 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): that is quite soon!
Sep 4, 7:32 PM
Dawn (Guest): Praise be to Jesus, I am happy for you Carol
Sep 4, 7:32 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): who will be there
Sep 4, 7:32 PM
Carol (Guest): Can you believe it?! He really does want me!
Sep 4, 7:32 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): yes!
Sep 4, 7:32 PM
Simone (Guest): Of course he does. Your bride groom
3 PM
Carol (Guest): As many of the Brothers and Sisters who can come will be there. Alas, much of my family teaches at the university level and school will be in session so they can’t get away
Sep 4, 7:33 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): we will be there in spirit with our prayers
:34 PM
Carol (Guest): Yes, please pray for me!
Sep 4, 7:34 PM
Simone (Guest): if you have a recording.. I would love to see it. We could watch it together on ZOOM
Sep 4, 7:34 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): yes
7:34 PM
Carol (Guest): I dont know if they will livestream it but they usually do record
Sep 4, 7:34 PM
Dawn (Guest): that would be wonderful.
Sep 4, 7:35 PM
Simone (Guest): wonderful.. just ask for the link for the recording.. and we can re-live it with you
Sep 4, 7:35 PM
Simone (Guest): if you want of course
Sep 4, 7:35 PM
Carol (Guest): It will take some time, but they will post it on our member site and then I will copy the link
Sep 4, 7:35 PM
Simone (Guest): perfect..
:36 PM
Dawn (Guest): Carol, do we still call you Carol? 7:36 PM
Simone (Guest): good question Dawn7:37 PM
Carol (Guest): Yes, you still call me Carol. My Saint name is Faustina. There is a very long story behind that!
Sep 4, 7:37 PM
Simone (Guest): by the way.. I got the chat – invite email now
7:38 PM
Carol (Guest): No email for me yet
Sep 4, 7:38 PM
Carol (Guest): I entered in through the door of mercy
Sep 4, 7:38 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): When you are ready here is first q for tonight 1. Of his injured leg, St. Francis wrote: “at this rate I should never want it to get better; no, not even if your Mother had come and had brought you along with her.” Was this a little tongue-in-cheek joke, or do you think it was a translation issue?
ep 4, 7:38 PM
Carol (Guest): Definitely tongue in cheek , 7:40 PM
John (Guest): Perhaps he meant it just as written
Sep 4, 7:40 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): Sister Brechard was one of the first or early Visitandines and I am not dure if Mother refers to St Jane or Sister’s birth mother
Sep 4, 7:41 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): I thought Sr Brechard’s own mom died young and she lived with her dad but I could be mistaken
41 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): The whole letter was a little different than most of St Francis’
Sep 4, 7:41 PM
Dawn (Guest): chat is acting up for me…hold on Ill be right back. a little holy water and a rosary…
Sep 4, 7:41 PM
Simone (Guest): I want to be honest … it sounds so very intimate – the way he writes.. and I guess a lot has to do with the style of writing in these days too.. but I cannot imagine writing a letter like this to my priest friends. What do you all think?
4, 7:42 PM
Simone (Guest): I know his heart was very pure.. I know that
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4, 7:42 PM
Carol (Guest): I think he is speaking as spiritual Mother, sister, daughter
Sep 4, 7:42 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): The whole style was much more intmate in general and flowery
4, 7:43 PM
Simone (Guest): I think so too Sister
Sep 4, 7:43 PM
Simone (Guest): it just shows a deep level of intimacy.Heart- intimacy
Sep 4, 7:44 PM
Dawn (Guest): Yes, and perhaps then people were more transparent and could express in beautiful ways…
ep 4, 7:44 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): I think there is a lesson contained in the letetr too
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5 PM
Simone (Guest): tell me about the lesson Sister
Sep 4, 7:45 PM
Dawn (Guest): what do you see Sr?
ep 4, 7:46 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): Indifference what I think he is trying to teach
Sep 4, 7:46 PM
Simone (Guest): Indifference to sickness?
Sep 4, 7:46 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): Go help your sick neighbors whom you dont know- not me whom you do or something like that
Sep 4, 7:46 PM
John (Guest): Abandonment to divine providence
Sep 4, 7:46 PM
Carol (Guest): That is food for thought
Sep 4, 7:46 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): no favortism because he is Bishop and Founder
Sep 4, 7:47 PM
Simone (Guest): oh .. I see…
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7:47 PM
Carol (Guest): The poor are not to be abandoned just because he is Bishop
Sep 4, 7:47 PM
Dawn (Guest): when he says we must conform to what is required by the rigor of other hearts?
Sep 4, 7:47 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): that ties in to q 2 2. What do you believe is at the heart of this letter?
Sep 4, 7:47 PM
Simone (Guest): as John said.. abandonment to God’s will
48 PM
Dawn (Guest): Hi John
Sep 4, 7:48 PM
Simone (Guest): actually – I meant my comment still to question 1 – but it also fits somewhat to question 2
Sep 4, 7:48 PM
John (Guest): Hi Dawn
Sep 4, 7:48 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): dont be distracted from your mission, so to speak
7:49 PM
Simone (Guest): and we are easily distracted from our mission
Sep 4, 7:49 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): seems similar to the incident when St Jane is on retreat and wants to grow in dependence on God but S Francis is sick and she can’t focus on her retreat
:50 PM
John (Guest): Well he had been tended to once for better or worse and he wanted the poor to receive the attention that he felt he could get later :50 PM
Simone (Guest): one of the hardest “tug a wars” in my heart – when the needs of my family interfere with my missional work
Sep 4, 7:51 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): and Dawn the rigor of other hearts might mean they would not understand the gesture by the Srs tending to the Bishop’s wound
4, 7:51 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): Yes Simone a real challenge, family vs mission :51 PM
Dawn (Guest): oh…ok
Sep 4, 7:52 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): that’s only one interpretation, there are probably others!
7:52 PM
Carol (Guest): And it might have been perceived as preferential treatmen
Sep 4, 7:52 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): yes
Sep 4, 7:52 PM
Simone (Guest): which St. Francis is the last one – to like
Sep 4, 7:52 PM
Dawn (Guest): it could have been
Sep 4, 7:52 PM
Simone (Guest): sorry – bad grammar
4 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): q33. What is the purpose of the emphasis that we are brothers and sisters in Christ? Is this just a nicety or does it have a deeper meaning p 4, 7:55 PM
Dawn (Guest): I thought this was a statement of truth 7:55 PM
Carol (Guest): We are all one body, but each has a different calling 6 PM
Simone (Guest): once we are “in Christ” – we all have God as father – therefore we are brothers and sisters. This is a spiritual connection – the terms ” son” and “Father” as St. Francis uses it – has a personal connection added to this. 7:57 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): personal meaning St Francis connection to the Sisters? 9 PM
Simone (Guest): not sure if I understand that question rightly Sister – but when St. Francis calls St. Jane “Mother” of one of the Visitandes ‘ daughter” – it has to do with their personal relationship within their spiritual love. But to be brothers and sisters in Christ – means – that we share the same spiritual DNA
Sep 4, 7:59 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): Oh yes I see what you mean
, 8:00 PM
Dawn (Guest): I thought St Jane was the mother, the spiritual superior of the sisters??
Sep 4, 8:00 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): brothers and sisters is essential in Christianity
Sep 4, 8:00 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): Yes Dawn she was
:00 PM
John (Guest): The connection is between a father and his daughters 4, 8:00 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): ah true p 4, 8:01 PM
John (Guest): That might explain the flowery “note” of the letter 8:02 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): q 4 4. What is more important, or souls or our bodies? 4, 8:03 PM
John (Guest): Our souls come first :04 PM
Carol (Guest): Souls. But we must care for our bodies so we can do our work
Sep 4, 8:04 PM
Simone (Guest): Pope JP2 said.. that a person is defined as a body and a soul. So – they are ONE unit basically. But intuitively I would answer like John here too.
Sep 4, 8:04 PM
John (Guest): But we are both; a soul alive in a body
Sep 4, 8:04 PM
Simone (Guest): the soul animates the body – a soul without a body ceases to be a person
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:04 PM
Simone (Guest): that is what death does – which was not intended to be originally p 4, 8:05 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): But at the Resurrection of the dead God will re unite in His way p 4, 8:06 PM
Simone (Guest): AMEN. that is the wonderful hope we have 4, 8:06 PM
Simone (Guest): we are eternal PERSONS – not just eternal floating souls
Sep 4, 8:06 PM
Dawn (Guest): Our body is the temple of the Holy Spirit, and I believe our soul continues to live eternally
Sep 4, 8:06 PM
Carol (Guest): So we are then both soul and body since Jesus did not creat the body to discard it
07 PM
Simone (Guest): well. that is the teaching of Pope JP2. I like how you word this Carol. : Jesus did not create the body to discard it?
Sep 4, 8:07 PM
John (Guest): Yes and Jesus was also human
Sep 4, 8:07 PM
Simone (Guest): sorry – no “?”
, 8:08 PM
John (Guest): And both will resurrected on the last day
Sep 4, 8:08 PM
Simone (Guest): being human is exactly this – body and soul together.. that’s why it is so mind-blowing that Jesus became human –
8:08 PM
Carol (Guest): We are created with bodies and those bodies will be transformed at the Resurrection into what they were meant to be 8:08 PM
Simone (Guest): yes, I think that too Carol. 8:09 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): we walk on delicate theological ground here- there were heresies that developed over this kind of discussion 8:09 PM
Simone (Guest): For me – I started to realize the privilege of being created as a human – a soul and body together – when I realized that Angels are not created with a body. 0 PM
Simone (Guest): OK.. Sister – I understand. I am so open to correction. Any time.
Sep 4, 8:10 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): no I don’t know enought about them or specifics- just that it happened
Sep 4, 8:10 PM
Carol (Guest): Let us not fall in to heresy!
4, 8:11 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): since we are just chatting and not proclaiming I think it is ok to explore 4, 8:11 PM
John (Guest): but guidance is appreciated 8:11 PM
Simone (Guest): it is a difficult theme. no doubt. I follow the teachings of “theology of the body” from JP2. I thought I am on safe ground with this.
Sep 4, 8:12 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): I think you are!
13 PM
Carol (Guest): It is easy to fall into the trap of believing the body is not important 4 PM
Simone (Guest): and that is what creates the base for so many horrible things. Because if you think that you can do with your body whatever you want- and it does not impact the soul – then the door is wiiiiiiiide open to do a lot of things with your body. including all the areas of abortion and euthanesia :15 PM
John (Guest): We must be careful stewards of ourselves :15 PM
Simone (Guest): yes. we must be. you are right John.
Sep 4, 8:15 PM
Carol (Guest): And there is also the trap of thinking the body belongs only to us when God created it. He created it, so it’s really His
Sep 4, 8:15 PM
Dawn (Guest): and of the innocent
Sep 4, 8:16 PM
Simone (Guest): good point Carol
Sep 4, 8:16 PM
Simone (Guest): and I smiled when I read your point Dawn.. You have a big heart my friend
Sep 4, 8:16 PM
Dawn (Guest): many good points here!
8:17 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): q 6. St. Francis mentions being with everyone in the “eternal liberty of love.” If we so often view love as self-sacrifice here on earth, what does love look like in the Trinity and what does love look like in Heaven where there is no need for giving of oneself in the midst of suffering and sin? 4, 8:17 PM
Dawn (Guest): so, let us take care of our self. and for those who are called, let us fight for the little ones Sep 4, 8:18 PM
Simone (Guest): yes Dawn.. marching onwards :18 PM
Dawn (Guest): Sr, good challenging questions , thank you
Sep 4, 8:18 PM
Simone (Guest): eternal liberty of love… can someone “translate” that to me?
4, 8:19 PM
Carol (Guest): I’m puzzling it out too 9 PM
Carol (Guest): I’m puzzling it out too
Sep 4, 8:19 PM
Simone (Guest): thanks Carol — I feel less stupid now
Sep 4, 8:19 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): St Francis de Sales encouraged liberty of spirit in many or all situations
Sep 4, 8:19 PM
Carol (Guest): LOL Simone
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4, 8:20 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): in eternity one loves without fear of what the neighbors will think 4, 8:20 PM
Dawn (Guest): this is truly freedom
Sep 4, 8:21 PM
Simone (Guest): liberty – it means in a way – freedom, right? so – eternal liberty of love – could be – that we are so detached from our “self-isn ness” – that we are fully free to love
2 PM
Simone (Guest): I sent a note to one of my directees – who struggles with love – and it said ” “Radical lovers cannot lose” – I think that comes close to this 24 PM
Simone (Guest): When my daughter was little – and cried in the middle of the night – then yes – you can call it “sacrifice” to get out of the warm bed and rock her back to sleep. BUT… because I loved her so much – staying in bed – ignoring her need would have hurt me even more.. so in a way – it was not a sacrifice. I think being in the midst of the Trinity – we are so full of love – that not loving – would be the punishment.
Sep 4, 8:24 PM
Simone (Guest): do I make sense here?
4 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): yes!
Sep 4, 8:24 PM
Dawn (Guest): I believe children experience this kind of freedom in love, pure,
Sep 4, 8:24 PM
Carol (Guest): Yes
8:25 PM
Dawn (Guest): yes!
Sep 4, 8:25 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): I think St Francis de Sales was in some way consoling the Sisters for not having invited them in to dress his wound
25 PM
Simone (Guest): ooh… I see.. yes.. because they would have loved to tend to his need
Sep 4, 8:26 PM
Simone (Guest): and express their love for him
Sep 4, 8:26 PM
John (Guest): and provide encouragment
Sep 4, 8:26 PM
Carol (Guest): But be knew they loved him and so redirected them
Sep 4, 8:26 PM
Simone (Guest): yes
7 PM
Simone (Guest): true love needs very little reassuring. There was a true liberty – knowing they love each other – he could release them
28 PM
Carol (Guest): And a person who cannot feel loved is not free
Sep 4, 8:28 PM
John (Guest): Francis put his cares last; the poor we always have with us. He did the noble thing, the most Christian thing to do
Sep 4, 8:28 PM
Simone (Guest): He was such a great role model for love, right John?
Sep 4, 8:28 PM
John (Guest): Yes
Sep 4, 8:29 PM
Dawn (Guest): a wonderful chat tonight, as so many are.
Sep 4, 8:29 PM
Simone (Guest): Nowadays leaders so often “suck” up all the attention they can get – and lead out of the need to be loved .. St Francis was so beautifully free of that
, 8:30 PM
Dawn (Guest): thank you Simone
Sep 4, 8:30 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): Wonderful insights tonight!
Sep 4, 8:30 PM
Carol (Guest): The greatest of all must be the servant of all
Sep 4, 8:30 PM
VisitationSr (Guest): May you all have a blessed week- I have to go now. Carol, may i share your news with the Sisters soi we can pray?