St. Francis says in the letter: “It is impossible for us to escape from self entirely.” Does this mean everyone will be going to purgatory?Why is it important if we achieve a certain status/stature that we must remain humble?How can we learn to be content as we are, while at the same time always desire to grow?How can we know God’s will?How could it be that we could be too anxious about growing in virtue?
ar 17, 5:28 PMSrSusan (Guest): last q Think of the phrase, “As long as I am serving God I don’t care what kind of sauce he puts me in.” When do we find ourselves complaining about the sauce we find ourselves in? And how so, in our thoughts and words?
Mar 14, 6:53 AM
SrSusan (Guest): Chat Sun Mar 17 730-830pm est
Mar 14, 6:54 AM
SrSusan (Guest): https://visitationspirit.org/2024/03/newsletter-for-sunday-chat-mar-17/
Newsletter for Sunday Chat Mar 17 | Visitation Spirit
Mar 16, 5:28 PM
OlgaD (Guest): Sister Susan, is the St Anselm Church could be the right place to go after Visitation monastery is closed?
Mar 17, 4:08 PM
answer (Guest): Go for Mass? yes
Mar 17, 4:33 PM
SrSusan (Guest): q St. Francis says in the letter: “It is impossible for us to escape from self entirely.” Does this mean everyone will be going to purgatory?
Mar 17, 4:34 PM
Simone (Guest): Hi Ruth!
Mar 17, 4:34 PM
Carol (Guest): Thats hard, but it seems likely we will without a special grace
Mar 17, 4:34 PM
Paula (Guest): Hi Ruth
Mar 17, 4:35 PM
Carol (Guest): HinRuth
Mar 17, 4:35 PM
Simone (Guest): In some ways it depends how you understand “self”
ar 17, 4:35 PM
Simone (Guest): we cannot escape from “self” – but we can sanctify it
Mar 17, 4:35 PM
SrSusan (Guest): Yes what is self
Mar 17, 4:36 PM
Simone (Guest): is there a special Salesian understanding of the “self”?
Mar 17, 4:36 PM
SrSusan (Guest): if we are baptized our true self is the mystical Body of Christ
Mar 17, 4:36 PM
SrSusan (Guest): not sure about Salesian understanding
Mar 17, 4:36 PM
Simone (Guest): but I do not think that’s what St. Francis meant here
Mar 17, 4:36 PM
SrSusan (Guest): no probably not
Mar 17, 4:37 PMPaula (Guest): well if we are doing God’s will….we should escape self focus
Mar 17, 4:37 PM
Simone (Guest): in the context – it sounds to me – that he means with the “self” the part in us that is directed to our will –
Mar 17, 4:37 PM
Paula (Guest): and not end up in purgatory
ar 17, 4:39 PMPaula (Guest): well it depends on how selfless we are and not worrying about us but others in doing God’s will
ar 17, 4:39 PM
Simone (Guest): and yet.. as St. Francis says — the pull to ourselves does not really leave us until we have passed this world
Mar 17, 4:40 PM
Carol (Guest): It seems that we can only skip purgatory by special grace. We can’t on our own
Mar 17, 4:40 PM
Simone (Guest): it does not mean that we have to lean into this “pull”
Mar 17, 4:40 PM
SrSusan (Guest): AS for purgatory it seems to be where many go
Mar 17, 4:40 PM
Simone (Guest): I agree Carol
Mar 17, 4:40 PM
Simone (Guest): I see purgatory as a place of grace and not condemnation
ar 17, 4:41 PM
Ruth (Guest): I think you are right, Simone.
Mar 17, 4:41 PM
Paula (Guest): we go to heaven by doing God’s will which is love and mercy itself
Mar 17, 4:41 PM
Carol (Guest): We want to bevwith Jesus–we have not rejected Him–but we are not free of sin
Mar 17, 4:42 PM
Simone (Guest): of course we want to be united with GOD. of course… but I think we underestimate HOW much of us has to be purified for this unity
Mar 17, 4:42 PM
Carol (Guest): True
Mar 17, 4:43 PM
Simone (Guest): and Paula you are right.. that is our goal for a holy life
Mar 17, 4:43 PM
Paula (Guest): well, we have to learn our lessons for heaven too…like how to be obedient….
Mar 17, 4:43 PM
Ruth (Guest): And don’t the souls in Purgatory also need our prayers?
ar 17, 4:43 PM
Paula (Guest): yep
Mar 17, 4:43 PM
SrSusan (Guest): yes indeed
Mar 17, 4:43 PM
Simone (Guest): I know this is not the question.. but I do not understand why they cannot pray for themselves – but apparently for others
Mar 17, 4:44 PM
Paula (Guest): self love
Mar 17, 4:44 PM
SrSusan (Guest): good question
Mar 17, 4:44 PM
Simone (Guest): what do you mean Paula with “self love”?
Mar 17, 4:44 PM
Simone (Guest): is it to be freed from self love fully?
Mar 17, 4:44 PM
Ruth (Guest): There is a thing called healthy self love.
Mar 17, 4:44 PM
Simone (Guest): so they even do not pray for themselves?
Mar 17, 4:45 PM
Paula (Guest): that would me that they are self love…they have to learn selflessness
Mar 17, 4:46 PM
Paula (Guest): and total dependence on God…like little children
Mar 17, 4:46 PM
Simone (Guest): OK, in some ways that does make sense.. on the other side.. it is also a longing to be closer to GOD – hard to understand that this will not be heard
Mar 17, 4:46 PM
Simone (Guest): I guess. it is the ultimate surrender to GOD’s will
Mar 17, 4:46 PM
SrSusan (Guest): q Why is it important if we achieve a certain status/stature that we must remain humble?
Mar 17, 4:46 PM
SrSusan (Guest): q Why is it important if we achieve a certain status/stature that we must remain humble?
Mar 17, 4:46 PM
Simone (Guest): otherwise we are dangerous – if we are not humble in a certain status
Mar 17, 4:47 PM
SrSusan (Guest): dangerous to ourselves as well?
Mar 17, 4:47 PM
Carol (Guest): No matter what great thing we did we are made of dust and will,return to dust
ar 17, 4:47 PM
Simone (Guest): yes.. good point Sister.. dangerous to us too
Mar 17, 4:47 PM
Paula (Guest): we would not have achieved it without God working in us
ar 17, 4:47 PM
Paula (Guest): we would not have achieved it without God working in us
Mar 17, 4:48 PM
Paula (Guest): everything comes from God
Mar 17, 4:48 PM
Simone (Guest): and everything shall go back to GOD
Mar 17, 4:49 PM
Paula (Guest): it’s God’s glory shining thru us
ar 17, 4:50 PMRuth (Guest): Humility is being face to face with REALITY. AND the reality is that we can do NOTHING without God.
Mar 17, 4:51 PMSrSusan (Guest): self sufficiency vs dependency
Mar 17, 4:51 PMPaula (Guest): as Fr. Larry Richard puts it …every breath is from God
Mar 17, 4:51 PM
Simone (Guest): self sufficiency is so much more dangerous than how it is treated in our society
Mar 17, 4:52 PM
Carol (Guest): It can tempt us to put ourselves in Gods place
Mar 17, 4:52 PM
Paula (Guest): dependency is good…unless you become humble as little children you shall not enter the kingdom of God
Mar 17, 4:54 PMSimone (Guest): I like that Carol
Mar 17, 4:54 PM
Simone (Guest): so much to shed— until we can become dependent on God
Mar 17, 4:54 PM
Ruth (Guest): Third try: humility is being face-to-face with reality, and the reality is that we could do nothing whatever without God. It is simply the right order of things.
Mar 17, 4:54 PM
Carol (Guest): As we were all,along
Mar 17, 4:55 PM
Simone (Guest): thanks Ruth
ar 17, 4:56 PM
SrSusan (Guest): as we age we often become dependent again
Mar 17, 4:56 PM
Paula (Guest): we have to follow Jesus and Mary who humbled themselves
Mar 17, 4:56 PM
Simone (Guest): and most people hate that
Mar 17, 4:56 PM
SrSusan (Guest): it prepares us I guess to solely depend on Him
ar 17, 4:56 PM
Simone (Guest): my answer – was for Sr. Susan;s comment
Mar 17, 4:57 PM
Paula (Guest): it’s ok. got it anyway
Mar 17, 4:57 PM
Simone (Guest): thanks Paula
ar 17, 4:58 PM
SrSusan (Guest): q How can we learn to be content as we are, while at the same time always desire to grow?
Mar 17, 4:58 PM
Simone (Guest): the whole euthanasia movement in Canada is based on the fact, that people do NOT want to be dependent in any way
ar 17, 4:59 PM
Paula (Guest): very sad
Mar 17, 4:59 PM
Ruth (Guest): As we were all along! But then we come to realize how dependent we’ve been.
Mar 17, 4:59 PM
Simone (Guest): to be content ” in HIS WILL” for us.. but at the same time being open to be even more in HIM
Mar 17, 4:59 PM
Carol (Guest): That is the first step to growth
Mar 17, 5:00 PM
Simone (Guest): as for dependency.. I always loved the quote ” You do not know that GOD is all you need…until GOD is all you have”
Mar 17, 5:00 PM
Carol (Guest): I can relate to that
ar 17, 5:01 PMSimone (Guest): back to our question…. being content… – when GOD showered my prayer times with graces and allowed me to step into a deep phase of purging of my soul… I wanted to rush holiness – badly -… well.. had to realize,.. that you cannot rush it.. and learned the hard way – “to be content … until He graces again..”
Mar 17, 5:02 PMSrSusan (Guest): that is wisdom Simone well written
Mar 17, 5:02 PM
Carol (Guest): My Sd keeps telling me not to run ahead of grace
Mar 17, 5:02 PM
Paula (Guest): we can be content in what we have (materially) but still crave God and holiness
Mar 17, 5:02 PM
Simone (Guest): Carol, I think the most dangerous place is to be one step ahead of Jesus
Mar 17, 5:03 PM
Carol (Guest): We think we know which way He is taking us and are too,eager
Mar 17, 5:03 PM
Simone (Guest): oh Paula.. I totally agree.. but I understood it – to be content in the “level” of our holiness.
ar 17, 5:04 PMSimone (Guest): eagerness can be very self serving…. sigh.. been there done that.. bought that T-SHirt 
Mar 17, 5:05 PMSrSusan (Guest): I am not sure I understand how to run ahead of grace- for ex doing a spiritual practice one is not ready for??
Mar 17, 5:05 PM
Paula (Guest): but SFDS says in the Treatise to always be climbing in love else you will lose charity
Mar 17, 5:05 PM
Simone (Guest): that is a good example Sister
Mar 17, 5:06 PM
Carol (Guest): Yes Sr Susan, or taking a step you’re not ready for
Mar 17, 5:06 PM
Ruth (Guest): A priest in the Russian Siberian prison was asked how he survived. He did not look for God’s will in the situation . He realized that the situation was God’s will, his permissive will. And that God could and would bring good out of it even if he died there.
Mar 17, 5:06 PM
Carol (Guest): Yes Paula we must climb at Gods pace
17, 5:07 PMSimone (Guest): Paula, I do not think that we should sit around being “content” with who we are. – thinking “well- good enough” – but also – not thinking ” this level of holiness is not good enough for me”… do you see the difference Paula?
ar 17, 5:07 PM
Simone (Guest): content – where God places me for now – but at the same time fully leaning into his love – always leaning into his love
Mar 17, 5:08 PM
Simone (Guest): I like that Carol ” climb at God’s pace” – that explains it well
Mar 17, 5:09 PM
Simone (Guest): Ruth, Are you talking about Fr. Walter Czisek? ( or similar- who wrote “with GOD in Russia” and “He leadeth me”?
Mar 17, 5:09 PM
Simone (Guest): I am currently going through the later book with a priest.
Mar 17, 5:09 PM
Simone (Guest): If you need a good gift for a priest – the book “He leadeth me” is a treasure.. for everyone . but I think specially for priests
ar 17, 5:11 PM
Carol (Guest): Or, it reminds me, the book Five Loaves and Two Fish
Mar 17, 5:11 PM
Simone (Guest): never heard of that book Carol
Mar 17, 5:11 PMRuth (Guest): Yes Simone. And you have written many wise things here.
ar 17, 5:12 PM
Carol (Guest): It is the story of the Vietnamese Cardinal whom was arrested
Mar 17, 5:12 PM
Simone (Guest): Ok, thanks Carol. Already found it on Amazon. Will purchase soon. Thanks
Mar 17, 5:12 PM
Carol (Guest): Spent years in prison, and even managed to minister while in solitary
ar 17, 5:13 PM
Simone (Guest): Is he the priest who was so beautifully visited by Jesus in his cell?
Mar 17, 5:13 PM
Carol (Guest): I think so…
Mar 17, 5:14 PM
Simone (Guest): wonderful.. I always wanted to read his story.. now I know the name of the book
17, 5:15 PM
SrSusan (Guest): q How can we know God’s will?How could it be that we could be too anxious about growing in virtue?
Mar 17, 5:15 PM
Ruth (Guest): Sounds interesting. We are all called to evangelize, even in “solitary.” Being a Christian ALONE is not being a Christian. it the HOW of our connection to the Body of Christ changes over time.
Mar 17, 5:16 PM
Carol (Guest): We see our own efforts and know they are small
Mar 17, 5:17 PM
Simone (Guest): yes Ruth.. so agree. Never do we read in the New Testament that a Christian was really alone. I think that even the vocation as a hermit is linked with passing on wisdom
ar 17, 5:17 PM
Paula (Guest): God’s will presents itself in our every day lives with those around us
Mar 17, 5:17 PM
Simone (Guest): Carol, can you explain your answer a little bit to me please?
Mar 17, 5:18 PM
Simone (Guest): yes Paula, I think so too
Mar 17, 5:18 PM
Ruth (Guest): Agree, Simone.
ar 17, 5:17 PM
Simone (Guest): Carol, can you explain your answer a little bit to me please?
Mar 17, 5:18 PM
Simone (Guest): yes Paula, I think so too
Mar 17, 5:18 PM
Ruth (Guest): Agree, Simone.
Mar 17, 5:19 PM
Simone (Guest): when it says “anxious” in the question here – it is meant “eager” or “fearful”?
Mar 17, 5:19 PM
Carol (Guest): We see how little we think we have accomplished and fear we will never get there
Mar 17, 5:19 PM
Simone (Guest): oh, I see… thank you Carol
Mar 17, 5:20 PM
Paula (Guest): or we know God’s will and are too anxious about accomplishing it
Mar 17, 5:20 PM
Simone (Guest): do you mean fearful Paula?
Mar 17, 5:21 PM
SrSusan (Guest): we’d have to look at the French to be sure but I read it as eager
Mar 17, 5:21 PM
Paula (Guest): like Abraham in the old testament we rush things
Mar 17, 5:22 PM
Paula (Guest): more eagerness than anxiety
Mar 17, 5:22 PM
Simone (Guest): I see.. oh yes.. fully guilty here.. if I think I have heard God’s will for something.. I run ahead..
Mar 17, 5:22 PM
Paula (Guest): yep
Mar 17, 5:23 PM
Simone (Guest): the longer I am here on earth – I realize.. GOD often speaks to me about those things very clearly that will NOT manifest in a long time.. and he speaks to me so clearly, so I do not dare giving up on them.. which I surely would do.. if I had not have heard his voice on this
Mar 17, 5:24 PMPaula (Guest): glad to hear it Simone!
ar 17, 5:25 PM
Carol (Guest): We can think we misheard Him
Mar 17, 5:25 PM
Simone (Guest): yes, if it takes sooo long
ar 17, 5:25 PM
Simone (Guest): and then we – or I am – are guilty of fathering Ishmaels
Mar 17, 5:26 PM
Paula (Guest): yeah…poor Abraham…long wait
Mar 17, 5:26 PM
Ruth (Guest): I think the reason or one of them anyway that God kept me alive is that I am a slow learner and he knows I want to get it right!
Mar 17, 5:27 PMSimone (Guest): it might be an engrained humility Ruth
Mar 17, 5:29 PM
Paula (Guest): I think He allows us to stay as long as possible to prepare us for straight entry to Heaven if possible
Mar 17, 5:29 PM
Carol (Guest): Ooh, I can whine with the best of them when things seem to be going from bad to worse
Mar 17, 5:30 PM
Simone (Guest): I love your longing for holiness Paula
Mar 17, 5:30 PM
Paula (Guest): thoughts first…our thoughts become our words
Mar 17, 5:29 PM
Simone (Guest): understandable though Carollast q Think of the phrase, “As long as I am serving God I don’t care what kind of sauce he puts me in.” When do we find ourselves complaining about the sauce we find ourselves in? And how so, in our thoughts and words?